isometric point crawl dungeons are just so stylish and sleek, plus they tend to leave room for your own notes instead of covering the page with cross hatching
Idolizing Gearings work is just par for the course. Lovely article, I will following along and making sure to read some of your back work. As long as you don't mind I will also be adding a link to your blog on mine!
This is interesting because it revealed to me something I didn't know about myself - my residual affection for graphically representational, rather than abstract, maps as GM tools (as opposed to aesthetic 'content'). But then, I'm old enough to remember how thrilled we all were with the novelty of the isometric map in 'Ravenloft', so this might just be nostalgia - which is always to be distrusted. As I, too, tend towards the improvisational as a GM it was also odd for to me to learn, in considering this idea, that I struggle slightly with the notion of having a 'sort of' map. I can - if necessary - make places up out of whole cloth, scribbling something like those plans as I go along to establish consistency, and I can make use of standard maps (of course). But something about the 'half and half' nature of this level of abstraction gives me pause, not because it's objectively inadequate (it's actually very clever) but because I seem to lean towards wanting either a blank canvas or a very detailed one. I absolutely concede that this is a 'me' problem and I'm sure I'll experiment with this technique to see if I can't train this weird hesitancy out of myself. Thanks for the shout-out.
I think that shows is that preparation is a spectrum! And in particular that the preparation is sitting in different areas. Really, my liking this pointcrawl approach to a dungeon is indicating that I don’t always like to improvise the layout/connectivity of a location. But I also understand how for some it’s either or, they want the full details or none at all. I enjoy working from no map as well as it turns out, but if I do have a map, these kind of layouts are typically what I would like, all personal preference at the end of the day!
Bug & Claw's overworld will be similarly handled to help communicate the depths at which different settlements can occur. Oddly, I hadn't even considered yet using it for dungeons! Haha
I like this because you could set up the boxes and connections first, then think what kind of dungeon and fill would fit it well. Makes a nice snug constraint before flavoring things out!
I'm thinking about His Majesty the Worm, a game where you give the players a map of the dungeon as a normal part of gameplay. Do you think giving players these kinds of maps, as opposed to artfully drawn ones with dimensionality and directionality, works just as well?
I think that depends on your goals! For me, I prefer it, because it keeps a sense of mystery about what these locations are whilst giving the players actionable information (where they can go). I find artful maps (personally) more restrictive. I want to describe things at the table exactly as I picture them in my head or write them. But I also want others to picture it in their own heads, their own unique version. Having a proper illustration (I've found) can take that away. Neither is better, but I think they each have strengths!
that's what i'm hoping as well - follow up questions: what about verticality within a single layer or a dungeon? do you have examples of that, where it's not so firm a separation as dungeon "levels"?
and, you've talked in other articles about the connection between points in the pointcrawl having its own information and such. in a map like this one, are you putting things in the corridors and connections? are there traps and such? how would you key the connections, and how can players do the same thing?
This really depends on the kind of structure I'm mapping, but typically I'll make notes on the connections within the entries for the rooms themselves. Sometimes that means duplicating information, but it makes for easier reference in my case!
For verticality within the locations, I'll describe that in my room notes because it's not per se a part of directional choice within the wider structure. So one of these locations in the dungeon I used it for was a highly vertical chamber with a series of bird cages suspended by chains. I just described that in my notes to the detail I needed to be comfortable with players exploring the space!
I just wanted to say thank you for this! Reading through your articles about this mapping style has seriously helped clarify some stuff in my mind for the way that i like to think about dungeons, and how i'll be designing moving forward!
I’m old and slow… 6 decades of hex and counter war gaming. Just got into ttrpg to tell stories better. I had been finding campaign maps on line and overlay grids in photoshop. Old habits… then I saw the Cairn map with the point crawl!🤦♂️ a little slow… your dungeon isometric was another moment. A major paradigm shift in how I think about managing my game play.
have been super excited for these articles to drop since seeing the map you posted on the OSR reddit. Can't wait to see the next two articles! This is basically how i run everything from dungeons to cities to regions to, little pointcrawls that allow a lot of room for notes. I really love Gradient descents map, The Electrum Archive also has a great region pointcrawl, that and the region generation for Vaults of Vaarn got me into making pointcrawls. Hype for the next articles!
oh nice, I saw this article had come out through my email, so I'm getting to all of this a bit late. I'll get to reading them. Thanks for putting in all this work!
Thanks for putting this together. As someone who HATES drawing trad dungeons and does every dungeon as an area/pointcrawl with connections (that’s even how I’ve developed my solo dice drop style dungeons in my own games I’ve put out) this is great.
this is also how every ttrpg for solo playing should be designed, so you dont know shit about the room until your inside of it
That’s a very neat idea!
isometric point crawl dungeons are just so stylish and sleek, plus they tend to leave room for your own notes instead of covering the page with cross hatching
Exactly that!
Idolizing Gearings work is just par for the course. Lovely article, I will following along and making sure to read some of your back work. As long as you don't mind I will also be adding a link to your blog on mine!
Not at all! Thank you so much!
This is interesting because it revealed to me something I didn't know about myself - my residual affection for graphically representational, rather than abstract, maps as GM tools (as opposed to aesthetic 'content'). But then, I'm old enough to remember how thrilled we all were with the novelty of the isometric map in 'Ravenloft', so this might just be nostalgia - which is always to be distrusted. As I, too, tend towards the improvisational as a GM it was also odd for to me to learn, in considering this idea, that I struggle slightly with the notion of having a 'sort of' map. I can - if necessary - make places up out of whole cloth, scribbling something like those plans as I go along to establish consistency, and I can make use of standard maps (of course). But something about the 'half and half' nature of this level of abstraction gives me pause, not because it's objectively inadequate (it's actually very clever) but because I seem to lean towards wanting either a blank canvas or a very detailed one. I absolutely concede that this is a 'me' problem and I'm sure I'll experiment with this technique to see if I can't train this weird hesitancy out of myself. Thanks for the shout-out.
I think that shows is that preparation is a spectrum! And in particular that the preparation is sitting in different areas. Really, my liking this pointcrawl approach to a dungeon is indicating that I don’t always like to improvise the layout/connectivity of a location. But I also understand how for some it’s either or, they want the full details or none at all. I enjoy working from no map as well as it turns out, but if I do have a map, these kind of layouts are typically what I would like, all personal preference at the end of the day!
Absolutely. Lord save us from the narcissism of small differences that is endemic in the hobby.
Bug & Claw's overworld will be similarly handled to help communicate the depths at which different settlements can occur. Oddly, I hadn't even considered yet using it for dungeons! Haha
I hadn’t either until recently! I love pointcrawls and have found running dungeons with that approach really suits me.
I like this because you could set up the boxes and connections first, then think what kind of dungeon and fill would fit it well. Makes a nice snug constraint before flavoring things out!
This is a great approach!
I'm thinking about His Majesty the Worm, a game where you give the players a map of the dungeon as a normal part of gameplay. Do you think giving players these kinds of maps, as opposed to artfully drawn ones with dimensionality and directionality, works just as well?
I think that depends on your goals! For me, I prefer it, because it keeps a sense of mystery about what these locations are whilst giving the players actionable information (where they can go). I find artful maps (personally) more restrictive. I want to describe things at the table exactly as I picture them in my head or write them. But I also want others to picture it in their own heads, their own unique version. Having a proper illustration (I've found) can take that away. Neither is better, but I think they each have strengths!
that's what i'm hoping as well - follow up questions: what about verticality within a single layer or a dungeon? do you have examples of that, where it's not so firm a separation as dungeon "levels"?
and, you've talked in other articles about the connection between points in the pointcrawl having its own information and such. in a map like this one, are you putting things in the corridors and connections? are there traps and such? how would you key the connections, and how can players do the same thing?
This really depends on the kind of structure I'm mapping, but typically I'll make notes on the connections within the entries for the rooms themselves. Sometimes that means duplicating information, but it makes for easier reference in my case!
For verticality within the locations, I'll describe that in my room notes because it's not per se a part of directional choice within the wider structure. So one of these locations in the dungeon I used it for was a highly vertical chamber with a series of bird cages suspended by chains. I just described that in my notes to the detail I needed to be comfortable with players exploring the space!
I just wanted to say thank you for this! Reading through your articles about this mapping style has seriously helped clarify some stuff in my mind for the way that i like to think about dungeons, and how i'll be designing moving forward!
You are most welcome! Do share your future designs too!
What software do you use to produce the point crawl graphics?
Hey! So I did this in Affinity Designer, but any program with some basic vector graphics capability and an isometric grid would work I think!
I’m old and slow… 6 decades of hex and counter war gaming. Just got into ttrpg to tell stories better. I had been finding campaign maps on line and overlay grids in photoshop. Old habits… then I saw the Cairn map with the point crawl!🤦♂️ a little slow… your dungeon isometric was another moment. A major paradigm shift in how I think about managing my game play.
Cairn is such a good game! Going through those kind of shifts in gaming can be fun I think, it’s nice when you experience an evolution.
If you like isometric dungeons, try Ker Nethalis. Excellent solo dungeon crawl. One of my faves!
I'll check it out!
have been super excited for these articles to drop since seeing the map you posted on the OSR reddit. Can't wait to see the next two articles! This is basically how i run everything from dungeons to cities to regions to, little pointcrawls that allow a lot of room for notes. I really love Gradient descents map, The Electrum Archive also has a great region pointcrawl, that and the region generation for Vaults of Vaarn got me into making pointcrawls. Hype for the next articles!
Thank you so much! You can check those out other parts right now! They should be released and up on the feed!
oh nice, I saw this article had come out through my email, so I'm getting to all of this a bit late. I'll get to reading them. Thanks for putting in all this work!
Thanks for putting this together. As someone who HATES drawing trad dungeons and does every dungeon as an area/pointcrawl with connections (that’s even how I’ve developed my solo dice drop style dungeons in my own games I’ve put out) this is great.
Glad I could help! It’s always great to have presentation/format options so we can pick stuff that suits us right?
For sure. I think a lot people get stuck in what they think they *have* to do for some reason. THIS IS A GAME DAMMIT
Amazing to hear! If you try it yourself, please do share the results!